About future new minor factions

Posted: December 13, 2011 in Rus Mod

Contrary to the official RUS , each new version suppressing AI factions ( gone are for now Anarchists, Poles, Ukrainians), Fatal Years has improved AI for them, and introduced 2 more:

-Freikorps in the Baltic

-French  and Greek units in the Ukraine.

 

More factions will be introduced in the next weeks. So I feel it’s high time to both give some clues about them and the reasons to not introduce others…

 

Will be created:

-The Galician faction, as Captain spotted it perfectly, because of their pivotal role between Reds, Ukrainian, Whites and Poles in Western Ukraine.

– Azeri, Georgian and Armenian will become AI factions too, even if their role will be most of the time passive. Denikin feared a Georgian attack in 1919 along the black Sea, so it could be a refreshing, even if unusual what-if.

I’m yet on the fence about Turkestan mostly because my knowledge about this area is poor. Once I will have got more information, the picture will get clearer in my mind.

Balts and Finns will remain subfactions without AI.OF course, there are obvious reasons to transform them in AI factions. except IMHO 2, which are the main:

– first, White players would have to strive for getting Finland help without in the end be able to control them. Frustration guaranteed

– this frustration would be increased by the impossibility for a human player to coordinate with an AI faction, even allied. Imagine a game where Finns would attack independently Petrograd in the same turn than you, without any possibility to ” mount” the joint attack. Or imagine you’re attacking Petrograd when the Finn AI waits passively. No fun, no game.

Other allied troops and Czech legion would create same problems with russian local troops.

 

In the end, indeed, the first criterium is enjoyment. The second is avoiding frustration by endless problems before human player units and AI one. ast is history.

But more factions is creating this unique situation, so badly portrayed in the official 1.04 version: fighting against several enemies at once, using diplomacy to transform some in Allies or at least in neutrals. In one word: chaos. Unique situation, which must be accurately displayed in any game of the RCW. Boardgames do. FY will do.

Comments
  1. Narval says:

    Azeri, Georgian and Armenian as Independant AI faction is a great idea of which I think I was always in favor.

    I see your point for the Finns, even though I believe that in the rare circumstances where they would be attacked by the Red without White Alliance, or even “attack on their own” due to the Karelian claims (especially if the Finnish Green army is not ousted for instance) , they should work as an Independant faction. I twould also make it more likely that the Red player attack them, as this way he would sort of ”prevent” an Alliance. That’s in an ideal world where I don’t get to do the modding.

    As for the Balts, from what I know of their history, they did not cooperate with the Whites (even Yudenitch) and I seem to remember fought a ”nominally” white army at some point {cannot find my documentation as I am abroad}.

    Of course, Estonia + Latvia situation is different from the Lituanian situation, the Lituanian have fought about everyone (Freikorps, Poles, Reds)

    For this reason, I don’t believe they should be a White sub-faction.

    On the other hand, talking is easy, you are the one doing the modding !

    • Clovis says:

      Estonian were part of the Yudenich offensive on Petrograd, supporting it in a very cautious but real way.

      The “White Army” you refer is certainly the Bermondt-Avalov episode. To simplify, when Allied pressed Germany to stop the Freikorps adventure in the Baltic, a large part of these troops, in a last bid, joined Bermondt-Avalov, a Russian officer, trying to build a sort of satrapy here. Technically, this army was white in name, opposed in reality to Allied, real White and anyone. In FY, the Freikorps is mutating into this Army during the course of the war.

      Wikipedia will present more in details this, even with some errors, but the general story is rightly depicted 🙂

      Relations between Lithuanina and Poles were more often warlike than alliance and their help to Reds was always on passive form, even in 1920. So the current White attachment of Lithunian works for the essential.

      Finland: Mannerheim was for an intervention but the majority of Finland was inclined to neutrality. The Olnonets operation, depicted in FY, was offically done by “volunteers”, not the official army. Mannerheim hoped vainly White would recognize officially Finland independence, which was necessary to convince Finnish opinion for coming back in the RCW. So the chances of autonomous Finland entry in war are IMHO so much slim it doesn’t be eligible to a creditable hypothesis. And, in case of reconnaissance by White, the White player would mourn the lack of direct control over Finns, whose intervention will be be limited to Northern Theater.

  2. Narval says:

    Well, you adress all points 😉

  3. Crusader says:

    Very good!
    I like what you did for the Baltics and Transcaucasia deserves an similar overhaul.
    The current setup is both ahistorical and boring.

    It is amazing what work you do as an single modder.
    To add a few humble suggestions:

    How about giving the White player options to enliste a few German units?
    First one to recruit like two regiments of German & Austrian POWs. (mostly to add flavour)
    Later, when the Freikorps withdraw an option to recruit some of their leftovers, which would provide a few units, but more important a few competent officers (kind of military advisors).
    Both, in addition to the standard ep and money cost, do also decrase the Intervention level.
    This would create an situation where only an White player that has already lost Allied support or is so close with the allies that they would look the other way, could afford to choose them.

    How about an Turkish nationalist Intervention in Transcaucasia (like their attack on Armenia)?

    How about a more detailed recreation of the fight in Mongolia (Chinese vs. White-Mongol-Tibetean alliance vs. Mongolian revolutionaries)?

    How about Siberians having a chance to save the Tzar (or Tzarevitch) alive if they capture Yekatarinburg quick enough (like with Kasan)?
    This could later (when continuing misery has shown that he was not soley responsible for all of Russias problems and Komuch have lost influence) give them an option to reinstate him as head of state. Opposed to the Assembly option this would decrase population loyality but provide an ralling point to the conservative groups (higher National Moral and lower dissent).

    Could one turn the Northern Whites into an independent subfaction that only merges with the Whites if some conditions are fullfiled?

    • Clovis says:

      Thanks. FY is a really curious sor of mod.For many reasons. But the first and formemost one is I LOVE play it.

      Enlisting German units: IMHO there are 2 situations or even 3 to distinguish:

      -POW enlisted by Reds in the first months, on Volga area by example.
      – German units servicing after Armistice in Ukraine. By example, between Odessa and Kherson, Nikolaïev harbour was garrisonned by a German unit under French nominal control, to maintain order
      – Freikorps idea you are proposing is interesting. Going to think about, because I would not want want to create an option which would be a no-brainer when the AIL is normally lowering after the first months of 1919. But it could indeed be interesting as would be BTW some representation of the link created between Bolsheviks and Germany after 1919, because they had common interest and common foes, like Poland ( Rappllo treaty was signed in 1922, but could too be an interesting POSSIBLE What-if).

      – Turkey and Mongolia: yes but I’m lacking sources on these parts of the conflicts

      -Tzar: no. I consider it would first create a so alternate history it would need many events to describe. In its way, it’s a scenario in itself. Secondly, The monarchy was so discredited in 1918 I ‘m very inclinbed to think White themselves would have sent The Inperial Family in exile. To the exceptionof a very few monarchist groups, most of the Monarchists kept silence about the subject, so unpopular was Tzarism. Even in exile, very few Whites supported restauration of the Monarchy. I knwo TOC companion has introduced some Tzarist Armies. I strongly disagree. The 1st Revolution established a Republic, whose even Rightist elements like Kornilov didn’t contested, to the diifference of democracy and socialism.

      Northern Whites: no, for gameplay reasons. In FY, each White faction must have a sort of weapon in the North, either to menace Petrograd. I’m violating history, but I add a strong element of tension for the Red player, and with this introduces the possibility of a White lethal menace both on Moscow and Petrograd.

      • Pat Cleburne says:

        I’ve always wanted a save the tzar option. I don’t know how possible it was, but it seems like if you could capture Yekaterinburg early you could save them. Maybe not a big effect on gameplay. Like a +1 to AIL if you save them from death and send them into exile.

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